tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8770341086445997547.post7310961426043137153..comments2023-10-07T22:37:49.244+13:00Comments on The Hand Mirror: Rest in peace, Adrienne Richkatyhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/15742280289613450293noreply@blogger.comBlogger16125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8770341086445997547.post-45590071612529356642012-04-15T17:21:49.887+12:002012-04-15T17:21:49.887+12:00Hi all,
I'm very sorry not to have been able t...Hi all,<br />I'm very sorry not to have been able to respond to this discussion earlier - I have been sans internet since I wrote it.<br />Firstly, I completely agree that all of someone's political positions are relevant if their political advocacy is being celebrated (which I was doing in the original post). So thank you to those commenters raising Adrienne Rich's role in the Transsexual Empire.<br />However, it turns out not only is her "contribution" to this book not very clear (in that both quotes come from Janice Raymond, not Rich herself), but that no one has been able to find anything else Adrienne Rich ever wrote which was transphobic. And the whole internet has been looking.<br />While for me it's problematic that nothing exists from Adrienne Rich which challenges those attributed statements in the Transsexual Empire, I also note her lover, in 1987, wrote a novel (No Telephone to Heaven) with a central trans character which trans historians have described as "sympathetic and positive." And that trans warrior Leslie Feinberg and hir partner Minnie Bruce Pratt have both publicly thanked Adrienne Rich for support and inspiration in their books in the past.<br />I think there is very little doubt that transgender issues were not discussed with care or compassion by the majority of feminists - or anyone else - in the 1980s. The fact we talk and think about gender diversity including trans and intersex issues, differently now is a wonderful, wonderful thing. <br />I think it's likely trans issues were not important enough to Adrienne Rich to renounce those quotes publicly. Transphobic? Yes, probably. Central to maintaining transphobia? In my opinion, based on these two quotes as the only evidence we have, no. Views open to change? Possibly, given the evidence of relationships with Minnie Bruce Pratt and Leslie Feinberg. Does it matter? Absolutely - but it does not, for me, undo the many other analytical gifts she gave to feminists and queer people and white people who care about racism.<br />Thanks, LJLudditeJournohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13154447284268192467noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8770341086445997547.post-66129965664607027412012-04-15T12:57:52.964+12:002012-04-15T12:57:52.964+12:00I didn't know about Rich's transphobic sid...I didn't know about Rich's transphobic side. Disappointing, considering that she was on the side of anti-censorship activism during the Minneapolis porn ordinance debates in the eighties and was strongly involved in antiwar activism in the Bush era. <br /><br />I want to pay tribute to the good work she did too-but I'd also appreciate some more details about her role in the Transsexual Empire, Raymond's hideous book. I do agree that there's a need for balance here.<br /><br />Craig Y.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8770341086445997547.post-81509564028565458572012-04-07T00:38:56.924+12:002012-04-07T00:38:56.924+12:00I'm also particularly shocked because how you ...I'm also particularly shocked because how you are reacting here is at complete odds with other comments you've made on the issue on trans rights here: http://thehandmirror.blogspot.co.nz/2011/06/all-apology.html<br /><br />ESPECIALLY this: "If you find yourself getting annoyed by what somebody is saying, please take the time to question whether that irritation is actually a feeling of privilege being called out. Often it is."<br /><br />Kind of weird, too, that you dismiss me because I'm a "troll anon" but it's not as if you're writing under your real name either...<br /><br />Shocked, Wellington.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8770341086445997547.post-38757629795163020932012-04-06T15:18:22.065+12:002012-04-06T15:18:22.065+12:00Fair enoughFair enoughAcid Queenhttp://www.shakesville.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8770341086445997547.post-17673759444355848242012-04-05T23:27:46.749+12:002012-04-05T23:27:46.749+12:00I find your "feminism" shocking if your ...I find your "feminism" shocking if your feminism consists of supporting and idolising transphobic bigots, yes. <br /><br />Shocked, Wellington.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8770341086445997547.post-85505230434612701882012-04-05T15:51:59.603+12:002012-04-05T15:51:59.603+12:00Acid Queen, please lay off the attacks on other co...Acid Queen, please lay off the attacks on other commenters. Thanks.antheahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05977317113072185299noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8770341086445997547.post-42122317569810218352012-04-03T16:22:49.131+12:002012-04-03T16:22:49.131+12:00I'm sorry you find the way I do feminism shock...I'm sorry you find the way I do feminism shocking.<br /><br />Luckily I don't give a fuck what some anon troll thinks.Acid Queenhttp://www.shakesville.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8770341086445997547.post-33572362661236278652012-04-02T21:16:15.221+12:002012-04-02T21:16:15.221+12:00I'm actually shocked that Acid Queen would tel...I'm actually shocked that Acid Queen would tell someone to stop criticising and "show some respect" to Adrienne Rich. What respect did AR show to trans women, whose bodies she said were manifestations of rape and mutilation? Yeah, didn't think so. In fact, she respected them so much, she actively contributed to their erasure, discrimination and hardship. <br /><br />She collaborated on the most transphobic book ever written. Any good shit she did kinda becomes irrelevant at that point. <br /><br />Shocked, Wellington.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8770341086445997547.post-5178265833036311082012-03-31T11:12:58.090+13:002012-03-31T11:12:58.090+13:00Agree with anon above. Part of remembering someone...Agree with anon above. Part of remembering someone's life is remembering them for their good works as well as their problematic and bigoted viewpoints.Carahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15414992519499602135noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8770341086445997547.post-25029698739602092912012-03-31T00:43:30.505+13:002012-03-31T00:43:30.505+13:00The time/place for critique is when people are hea...The time/place for critique is when people are heaping un-countered praise on somebody who actually harmed quite a lot of people. So it's definitely appropriate to discuss that. She did a lot of great stuff, but there's no point glossing over her blatant transphobia and pretending like she was perfect. <br /><br />me.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8770341086445997547.post-14117105217633420832012-03-30T17:51:00.034+13:002012-03-30T17:51:00.034+13:00Verbscape, there's a time and a place to criti...Verbscape, there's a time and a place to criticise Rich. This isn't it. Show some respect.Acid Queenhttp://www.shakesville.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8770341086445997547.post-74284030827244037802012-03-30T17:11:20.304+13:002012-03-30T17:11:20.304+13:00Unfortunately Rich leaves a legacy of substantial ...Unfortunately Rich leaves a legacy of substantial transphobia; she was heavily involved in Raymond's <i>The Transsexual Empire</i>, which casts trans women's bodies as rape and refers to them (quoting Rich) as "castrated men". Her contributions are flawed to say the least.verbscapenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8770341086445997547.post-29314170662934668592012-03-30T16:46:37.495+13:002012-03-30T16:46:37.495+13:00I'm happy to infer the word "compulsory&q...I'm happy to infer the word "compulsory" in that sentence if it helps.<br /><br />I got into feminist poetry at high school and love Adrienne Rich. She made a significant contribution.Tamaranoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8770341086445997547.post-83987510596589235992012-03-30T13:08:05.220+13:002012-03-30T13:08:05.220+13:00Actually, I'd rather comments for this post fo...Actually, I'd rather comments for this post focused on Adrienne Rich, not my admittedly limited use of the English language, thanks :-)LudditeJournohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13154447284268192467noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8770341086445997547.post-72176846185638481172012-03-30T12:48:09.182+13:002012-03-30T12:48:09.182+13:00God, Psycho, picky picky.
You know what she meant...God, Psycho, picky picky.<br /><br />You know what she meant, OK?<br /><br />Stop trying to find excuses to be offended and maybe spend a bit more time examining your hetero privilegeAcid Queenhttp://www.shakesville.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8770341086445997547.post-51482725413474892432012-03-30T07:48:03.604+13:002012-03-30T07:48:03.604+13:00...she fisked the idea that heterosexuality is nat...<i>...she fisked the idea that heterosexuality is natural rather than socially constructed...</i><br /><br />Haven't read the book, but really hope it doesn't reflect the literal meaning of that quote, as that literal meaning is so obviously wrong it hurts.Psycho Milthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00779500926576047736noreply@blogger.com