i'm sure plenty of people will have watched the campbell live story on the boy with buck teeth*. i didn't watch myself, but saw the ads both yesterday and today.
i know they're patting themselves on the back for a successful story and a very positive outcome for this child - the positive outcome being something along the lines of some kind of dental treatment to fix the problem. and sure, that's great for the child and it gives us all such a nice, warm, fuzzy feeling when we think about how generous we are as a nation in coming to the rescue of the this child.
the reason given for the surgery - at least the only reason i saw on the promos - was that the boy was being bullied and teased at school, and this surgery would stop that. i'd be interested to hear from anyone who's watched the show (i don't really feel that i can bear to watch at this point) whether they actually addressed the aspect of bullying and teasing? in other words, did the show make the point that bullying and teasing someone for their physical appearance is wrong, and needs to be addressed by the school and by the adults responsible for the children who interact with this boy?
because i'm feeling really uncomfortable with the notion that the answer to bullying and teasing is spending money to change your appearance. [as an aside, i make no judgement of people who choose to so spend their money, particularly in a culture such as the one we currently live in]. because that isn't the answer. the answer is to edcuate people in our society to be more accepting of physical difference - or emotional difference, or racial difference, or religious difference.
campbell live can't spend every episode highlighting a person suffering from bullying and asking for money so that they can change their appearance. there are so many, many kids and adults out there without the funds or the ability to change the way they are. if anything needs to change, it's the culture they live in, that we live in, where casual cruelty is seen by some people to be acceptable.
so while this sounds, on the face of it, to be a fairy tale - like the waving of a magic wand, this young boy's troubles will suddenly disappear - it doesn't deal with the actual problem. the actual problem is not the boy and his teeth. and there is absolutely no guarantee, once his teeth are "fixed"** that the bullying won't continue. once you're a marked person in the eyes of bullies, you often stay that way regardless of the changes you make. because the problem is not with you, it's with the bullies.
in any case, i wish this child well and hope his life gets better. i hope it wasn't too embarassing to have his "problem" publicised on national television, but i suspect he doesn't mind given that he can now have it fixed. and i really wish that this feeling of goodwill expressed by the nation would extend to all of those who live in poverty or with any other difficulty in their lives.
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* is there a better way to say this? i really hate that phrase but it was the one the programme used and i can't think of an alternative at this time of night.
** i use the quote marks because i personally don't believe there is anything really wrong with them, unless they are causing some kind of health problem.
38 comments:
'overjet' is the technical term for buck teeth but I had to look that up as I couldn't think of any other term other than perhaps 'overbite' but I don't even know if that is correct (overbite that is)
I think this episode showed one of the major flaws with charity. Tv3 showed this boy's story, and raised $99,000 for him. That money could probably have addressed the dental health problems of 50 kids. But instead, we get a situation where one family's needs are over catered for, while other needy families miss out. Strikes me that it would have been better for dental care to be state funded, so this issue could be addressed fairly and efficiently.
As someone who had severely bucked teeth as a child and teen, the benefits of having them fixed were not just social, but also physical. My teeth weren't quite as bad as this kid's teeth, but they were close. Being able to close your mouth properly is a pretty big deal!
@scar: fair enough, hence the bit in my footnote re health reasons. the thing is that the programme didn't sell this thing as improving the kids health or making it easier for him in terms of closing his mouth. i just found their framing re bullying really problematic.
I half-watched this when it was on, as far as I remember there was discussion about the impact on his eating and speech because they were trying to make the case that the treatment should have been publicly funded (which it would be harder to if it was "just" cosmetic), though interesting if they chose to go with the other angle in the promo. The comment was made that his school friends have come to accept his appearance and that he is ok for now but that he gets a hard time when out among strangers and there was apprehension about starting high school, so not so much an issue with his current school situation.
Surely its up to the boy and his parents to decide weather or not to have surgery to correct his apperance. We are not talking about a "nose job" or a "brest enhacement" on an teen girl of normal appearance. The disfigurement that this boy suffers from is truly awful & if it can be remedied then that can only be good. To me it seems high handed and dismissive of this boys feelings and that of his parents to say there is nothing wrong with his apperance and he should get over it.
@SMSD - I agree. Another case annoyed me for a similar reason: http://www.stuff.co.nz/auckland/local-news/6128191/Dying-mum-blown-away-by-response
I mean, yes, her story is tragic and it's sad she's dying. But giving her $20,000 in charitable donations just so she can have a SECOND wedding just before she dies...it seems wasteful and unnecessary. That money could have been much better spent helping the hundreds of NZ kids battling cancer themselves. I dunno. Things like that make me feel uneasy particularly because the people benefiting always seem to be white, otherwise attractive and articulate.
L.L.
The thing that bothered me about (the ads for) the story was that it seems to show a fundamental failure in our health and/or social welfare systems.
The advertising I saw was focussed on raising money to help out, not asking why our health and social welfare systems weren't there for someone in need.
To me it seems high handed and dismissive of this boys feelings and that of his parents to say there is nothing wrong with his apperance and he should get over it.
i said absolutely no such thing - in fact quite the opposite. try reading the post again.
@SMSD & others: that's a really good point regarding public funding, particularly public funding for dental health.
@katy: thanx for letting us know how they actually dealt with the story - doesn't sound as bad as the promos made it sound. but yes, they really needed to be asking the public health questions.
I've been thinking about this a lot lately and have to say that I'm extremely uncomfortable with the line of reasoning you're presenting here, Stargazer.
Specifically the idea that if there's nothing medically wrong with something and it's not causing health problems, then money shouldn't be spent fixing it.
As someone who has spent an ungodly amount of money fixing a 'perfectly healthy' body, I'm very ill at ease with this.
My personal take on this follows the pro-choice rhetoric:
"My Body My Choice".
Specifically the idea that if there's nothing medically wrong with something and it's not causing health problems, then money shouldn't be spent fixing it.
that's not my line of reasoning, scar. rather, it's that people shouldn't be pressured into "fixing it" because of bullying, nor should they expect that the bullying will necessarily stop because they have "fixed" what the bullies perceive to be a problem. as i've said very, very clearly in the post, i make no judgements of individual choices.
It's at this point I have to ask: have you had something surgically fixed to stop bullying and not had the bullying stop afterwards?
Because I had a remarkable improvement in my rate of being bullied after I had my teeth fixed (and later on, after I had the rest of my body fixed).
I have to wonder what your basis for comparison is.
The benefits of surgically fixing issues to stop people being horrible to you aren't all external; a lot of it has to do with feeling a whole lot better about yourself once it's done, which comes through in your confidence levels and social interactions. I'm a massively more social and confident person now after my various cosmetic changes than I ever was beforehand.
i agree with what you're saying scar, that especially under current cultural conditions an individual will definitely get some benefits, hence why i said i don't judge individuals.
the things i was bullied about in my childhood couldn't be fixed with money, unless i went through extensive bleaching, changed my name, and tried to make out that i was a white person born in a western country. i'd have had to ask my parents to do the same.
hence why i have an issue with the framing of the promo to this: it's the bullying that needs to stop. the culture of callously judging people and denigrating them for things that are unfair and totally unnecessary.
You see Stargazer you say "I make no judgement of individual choices" but every other word you've written is full of judgement, and if you're not aiming this judgement at the choice of the boy and his parents, who are you aiming it at?
i'm aiming it at a society that makes these kinds of judgements about people's worth based on their appearance. and at the promo to this programme ignored the whole issue of dealing with bullying by working at changing this kind of culture. i thought that was quite clear from the post.
I'm sure you did Stargazer but the author is not usually the best judge of the clarity of their writing. That's why students don't mark their own essays.
You have a history of assuming that anybody who doesn't divine the true intent of your posts is maliciously twisting your words, rather than genuinely misunderstanding. I think when your posts touch on issues where you have privilege and others don't (eg transgender issues) you should be more receptive to the idea that you weren't clear in what you wrote.
I kinda agree with Acid Queen; your statements feel, to me, somewhat odds with one another.
I understand that you're trying to address the bullying issue, but in doing so you're treading on other delicate issues surrounding cosmetic surgery and body mods.
I'm wondering whether or not you have the experiences to understand this, since the thing you were bullied for (your ethnicity) is only out of the ordinary in certain environments, whereas being born with physical issues (such as extremely prominent teeth or body dysmorphia) is much farther outside the norm. It's not like this kid's family all have teeth like this, nor are my family all trans.
I know first hand how it feels thinking that you're the only person in the world with your particular problem - it's a very potently distressing feeling and it isn't fixed just by forcing people to treat you no differently.
You still know you're different.
And they still know it too.
You have a history of assuming that anybody who doesn't divine the true intent of your posts is maliciously twisting your words, rather than genuinely misunderstanding.
i absolutely dispute that and don't appreciate an accusation of bad faith here, nor in your previuos comment. especially after i'd stated explicitly in the post that i wasn't judging individual choices, and have said so again in comments. i notice that you have a history of making personal attacks on this site and i'm going to ask you to refrain from commenting further on this post.
"I'm wondering whether or not you have the experiences to understand this, since the thing you were bullied for (your ethnicity) is only out of the ordinary in certain environments, whereas being born with physical issues (such as extremely prominent teeth or body dysmorphia) is much farther outside the norm. It's not like this kid's family all have teeth like this, nor are my family all trans."
Woah Scar. If stargazer doesn't have the experiences to understand this issue, I'm not sure you have the experiences to understand what it's like to be the only coloured person in your all-white school. I really, really think you shouldn't have said that. Having your entire family also be different from every other family at the school does not actually make it any better.
I don't know if you're coloured or not but your comments, which seem almost flippant, suggest that you haven't experienced this particular type of marginalisation. It can be really, really, really bad; so bad that I've wanted to change everything about me to conform, but I can't. That can't be 'fixed' by any amount of money. (But if it could, and someone had the money, I would not judge them for doing so.)
I don't think you should dismiss bullying on ethnicity as not being far enough outside the norm - in some contexts, it's as far as you can get (especially in that my skin colour alienated me culturally from my peers - in that they assumed subconsciously that they wouldn't really get along with me, being that look Indian and they don't look Indian).
I don't think you *really* understand marginalisation by colour, based on those comments.
I think that having family who share the same characteristics that make you oppressed is a pretty huge deal, actually.
However, I guess we will have to agree to disagree on that matter.
ok, i feel like we're getting into competition of marginalisation territory here (aka oppression olympics) & it's making me uncomfortable.
i will say though that just because your family has the same characteristics as you doesn't mean they have exactly the same experience or understanding of what your life is like. given that they may have grown up in a different country, the amount of support they are able to offer could be limited.
and as for being outside the norm, i was the only child who wasn't of european or maori ethnicity out of 600 kids, in both primary schools i attended. i think perhaps you don't have a good idea of what the norm was in the 1970s.
but as i said, it's not a competition. and my main thoughts are for those who can't change, because they can't afford it or because they have an inherent characteristic that can't be changed. they know they're different, that they'll always be different, and that they personally can't change who they are.
i still go back to my original point, that framing this the way they did in the promo sends the wrong message about bullying. and as others have commented, takes the focus away from providing public services for health issues.
Then let's concentrate on that issue: how do you suggest we cause a blanket change to society so that kids who currently have extremely bucked teeth don't get stared at and talked about unkindly?
(And I'm not surprised that the discussion of marginalisation is making you uncomfortable; considering you've wilfully called me a man before. That would be considered 'bullying' wouldn't it?)
I've missed this post and discussion until now. Some pretty heavy throwing around of accusations and personal attacks.
stargazer can I just say how much I always enjoy your discussions of marginalisation around skin colour, race/ethnicity, religion and culture - it's my experience when you talk about marginalisation that you go places well beyond many's comfort, and I personally appreciate the learning.
I think it is tricky to talk about unravelling cultural norms which are oppressive without appearing to judge individual choices, because individual choices are how we do culture. But my reading of this post is that it matters that tricky position well - so thank you.
And I could not agree more with the substantive point - promoting changes which some people will never be able to access because we have a culture of treating difference badly is very very sad. None of which means the young man in this story shouldn't be able to access surgery, as you've said.
To paraphrase ani difranco "which one is different and does not belong? They taught me difference was wrong." I'd say those are the cultural changes we need to make, changing the idea that difference is wrong, and addressing where difference makes substantive differences in access to resources - so dismantling capitalism, racism, sexism and cis-sexism, homophobia,transphobia and biphobia.
Something for the new year.
thanx LJ, you've put it so well. changing the culture is always an incremental process, and it begins with calling out the little things, increasing awareness, showing people a different way to look at what's happening, challenging their assumptions.
as you say, i have no problem with this little boy having the procedure nor with anyone else who chooses to do so. that doesn't mean we shouldn't look at the way things are presented to us and the hidden (and sometimes quite explicit) messages that are being given out, particular by our mainstream media.
(And I'm not surprised that the discussion of marginalisation is making you uncomfortable; considering you've wilfully called me a man before. That would be considered 'bullying' wouldn't it?)
it's not the discussion of marginalisation that bothers me, not at all. it's the notion that there's some kind of competition or scale of marginalisation that bothers me.
as for calling you a man, i apologised at the time and am happy to apologise again.
I think that as soon as differing oppressions were brought up (cosmetic surgeries vs race) that the a 'scale' of oppression started to be introduced.
Perhaps there's a bit of 'apple vs oranges' going on here?
I accepted your apology at the time and I accept it again; my point was that perhaps we need to work on and recognise our own bullying behaviour before we do a general call out on it?
That incident is still a little too fresh for me to ignore in context with your call to end bullying.
I don't think that's unreasonable of me, but perhaps you feel differently.
does it occur to you scar that i also feel bullied in my own space, especially with the constant accusations. some of which happen to be far of the mark. i'm also feeling that i'm not being heard by you here, that you're not appreciating my experiences while accusing me of being bullying. i'm sorry that the incident is still fresh for you, but i don't believe it's a reason for me to stop pointing out things i see are wrong. i see that as a silencing tactic, which is also feeling like bullying to me, and i don't like it.
I'm really sorry that you feel that way.
I won't post again.
Im really against getting any sort of surgery that is not medically necessary, I find it so sad that people would bully this kid.
Then again, Im for choice if he wants it, then he should do it.
So Stargazer, when trans-people say that your statements are harmful to their identity, you feel bullied?
I'll keep that in mind next time you say you want a world where bullying doesn't exist.
when trans-people say that your statements are harmful to their identity, you feel bullied?
no CV. i feel bullied when i'm accused of saying things i haven't said, such as your comment above. if you read my comment, i stated that i found this part of scar's comment to be silencing:
my point was that perhaps we need to work on and recognise our own bullying behaviour before we do a general call out on it?
especially when it was in relation to an incident which i had already recognised and apologised for. i also didn't appreciate the way my own experiences were sidelined and dismissed as unimportant and/or irrelevant.
perhaps you might go back and reread my comments. i've said repeatedly that i agree with individual responses to a society which that places so much pressure around appearance and conformity. i appreciate that scar has shared the positive effects of particular procedures. i think the disagreement is more around the fact that, for some people, making changes won't stop bullying behaviour, and for others it's not possible (whether due to financial or other reasons) to make changes to their own inherent characteristics. my concern is that, as a society, we shouldn't be bullying people into conformity. however, i agree that some people will feel better off having made those changes, for any number of reasons. i don't dismiss those experiences at all, and i don't believe that they take away from my overall point.
'Trans people' doesn't have a hyphen.
AQ, yet again you show just how little you care to respect boundaries. we have stated clearly that issues of moderation are to be discussed by email, but you choose not to respect that. i've directly asked you not to comment further on this thread and you choose not to respect that. at this point, my comment policy towards you is that i don't want you commenting on any of my posts.
Just a weird observation; I've read through all the past comments you've made about me, Stargazer, and you have never used a female pronoun to refer to me.
Maybe you could throw the trans woman a bone sometime and call her 'she' like everyone else?
i've read through all the comments on this post scar, and there is only one where i speak about you rather than to you, in order to make a point. i've read over that one comment a few times and am not sure where i would have fit a "she" in. but i'll keep your point in mind, and if there is another occasion where i mention you, i'll make an effort to put the pronoun in.
I was also referring to the stuff that happened back in June, and before that as well (elephant memory and a sensitive spot for missing pronouns).
But thank you for taking it into consideration :-)
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